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2013 - "You are a self-centred group",
sent by a reader
|You guys here seem quite petty.
up amongst the Nazarenes and they are a rare and very self-centred
group. I have never encountered genuine evangelism as is biblical, the
loving of those who need to have a real Jesus in their lives. I have
long seen a closed minded group who seek to praise/offend each other
and do not worry about the long term impact of their teaching and
chastisement on their youngsters. Sadly it's almost comical to follow
these pages as they really show how non influential the Nazarenes seem
be when it comes to making a Christ like impact in this world. It's
good that this is the case, otherwise we would be fruit loops
struggling to deal with our huge sins (seriously people the things the
Nazarenes are offended by) that we were warned against all our young
life!! Why shouldn't people who do the wrong thing be taken to court??
Why hide behind a bible passage to deny sin the exposure it deserves??
Believe me, Jesus is very widespread and not bound by a small group
greater goal than to shelter themselves within their groups and
pride themselves on being white washed tombs. Does it matter how good you
your heart is only glorifying itself. Sheesh, get into the real
world... People are desperate for real connections, not some fake let's
be holy and pat each other's back rubbish. My heart is full because God
plucked me from the joy stealing life that was the Nazarene church! If
you want something to fight for and expose, let it be the Gospel that
really does justice to the Jesus of the Bible. Whoever runs this site,
likely we know each other and so sad that as much as you plead good
intent, you through your posts wording take joy in mocking those you
write about. Be sure that this wanton ambition is nothing to pat
yourself on the back about. Where is the support for those who were
exposed to the legalism and coldness growing up in this group? What
good comes of any of this? Still no gospel? Still nothing more than
your own little parade?
this coming Sunday, We wonder how many Christians will cover themselves
properly when attending Church? From top to bottom, talk about
disobedience. The head covering topic really hit the spot. We need
revival. Come on everyone, let's begin again, love and respect for God
and each other. Amen.
the 20 August comment, you have some extremely good points that you
wrote. Yes, the website seeks to mocks those who are in the wrong. Does
it make them any better? Absolutely not. Are Nazarenes self-centered? I
guess I never thought about it too much but we are. But Nazarenes
actually used to be EXTREMELY evangelizing. You probably don't believe
me but its true. Its back when the faith was spreading like wildfire
throughout Europe in the 1900s and on. However, over the years, this
faith "iskvarila se." It is now not only about how worldly can we be,
but there is a lot of hate. So sad. This website drives my point home.
And to the comment that says "so why do you look at it?" Yes, it's true
I'm wrong for looking at it. And probably even wronger for posting. I
used to post more in the past and realized it wasn't right. So I asked
the site to post an apology but they wouldn't. That's all right. We
will all give an account for ourselves. Is Paul rotten? Absolutely. But
so is this website, and it certainly doesn't help me that I read it.
Anyway, while most of your points are good, the part about "take him to
court and don't hide behind a Bible passage but expose his sin" is
incorrect. Jesus says never take a brother to court. And about exposing
his sin; well I agree somewhat if they are causing havock in the
church; but nonetheless Jesus says, let the wheat and tares grow
together until the harvest, and then gather the tares in bundles and
burn them. I don't wish this for anyone, and I pray God's mercy on us
all. It's the only thing that will save us: His mercy. Not ourselves.
the website people: Would it be possible that you delete all the rude
comments about Ljubica and her head cover and whatever? What did she do
for her to be plastered all over the internet like this? At least the
abusers have reasons. Ljubica is innocent. And plus, someone will
probably print the page out and give it to her and she will be very
Ljubica is aware of this website and her photos. She is
actually grateful for the support she received during her days in the
Without that support she would probably still be locked there.
1, you can wrap yourself from head to toe in whatever you want. Revival
will not come by how much the women cover themselves. True revival will
come when Elders humble themselves and become Servants not rulers.
Let's focus on the real problems not what just looks good on the
outside. If you are right on the inside the outside will show. I do
agree on your latter part of the comment. Lacking love and respect for
God and each other is the root of all problems.
need to choose who you want to serve:
the "Lord Jesus Christ" by following his doctrine and his example (for
which you WILL be persecuted, but in the next life receive eternal joy
and love and happiness)
2) "sin", this world, yourself,
own desires. And interpreting (actually miss-interpreting) the Bible to
suit your choices in life, for which you will find only partial or
temporary satisfaction, and in the next life excruciating torment in
everlasting fire, where the worm dieth not and the flame in never
These are facts. Do not be swayed by the "noise" of everyday problems.
Focus on your goal. Focus on Jesus Christ. Focus on the Word of God.
commented this, "My heart is full because God plucked me from the joy
stealing life that was the Nazarene church!" Are you saying that there
is no salvation in the Nazarene faith? The Nazarene faith is "Not Joy
Stealing", what "joy" are you talking about? There is "joy" of this
world - which is sin. And there is joy in the Lord, which every saved
The Church does not take joy away from you. Sin does.
in regards to the current issues, the answer is in the Word of God.
Plain and simple. It is sin for a believer to take a believer to court.
Sisters in the Lord need to have proper head coverings. We as
Christians need to accept to carry the cross. If you do not want to
carry the cross, then you are not a true Christian.
render evil for evil. Turn the other cheek, this means to do good to
them (also) who are mean to you. If someone is mean to you, don't be
angry or hurt, you should feel pity and sorry to those people who are
Rom 12: Recompense to no man evil for evil.
Provide things honest in the sight of all men. If it be possible, as
much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men. Dearly beloved,
avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is
written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord. Therefore if
thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so
doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head. Be not overcome of
evil, but overcome evil with good.
Think clearly. (For you
to be able to "think clearly" you must put aside "me" and "I" and "my
will" and look into the Word of God.) It has all the answers.
Peter 4:8 And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves:
for charity shall cover the multitude of sins.
Romans 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is
the fulfilling of the law.
Proverbs 8:13 The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and
arrogance, and the evil way, and the forward mouth, do I hate.
97:10 Ye that love the LORD, hate evil: he preserveth the souls of his
saints; he delivereth them out of the hand of the wicked.
made the "joy stealing" comment. Yes, the joy that God gives to all
those He has called by His grace. Key word there is grace. You see, I
don't indulge in patting myself on the back for my efforts for God.
Rather the joy that I have is in knowing Jesus gave His life for me and
all my sinfulness. It's a mockery of God to say you all have no sin,
weakness but not sin after baptism. Seriously people? Is there no
looking into the heart at all amongst you? The joy that was stolen from
me and my siblings is the joy that a forgiven Christian can have even
in a sin filled world. I watched "fake" joyless people making out as if
their little trials were some service to God. That they would possibly
be granted heaven if they just persevered until the end. The Bible is
specific in stating that God called His people, that He never forsakes
those who are predestined and that we have salvation now. It is never
taken away. Would you believe that your own conduct testifies to the
lack of Jesus in the Nazarene church. I am blessed that those around me
are evangelical Christians. They have loved The Lord for decades and
are not deceived by people who look the part but have an empty heart.
Believe me the bulk of you were so quick to reject the friendship when
I no longer went to church. No love that wins people, no hope or kind
words for those who are not prepared to pretend they are good. People,
I have lived this all my life and because I know my heart I know yours
as the Bible says "there is no one good, no not one.. All have turned
away..." "If man lived for but one day, he would not be without sin"
how then this pretend godliness? You people are infuriating in that you
lie to yourselves and then try to lie to others. I look at people and
see just how sad the pretence is. I see the moms who in the church are
so quiet and soft,
these same moms that belt their kids until they are
dads that are ordered and in control. That then go on to make their
wives prisoners to large amounts of children whilst they eye off woman
that they cross paths with at leisure. Seriously, why pretend? Don't
bother with the whole thing about God giving kids. I've got a bunch of
them, happy I have them and yet know that there are safe, Christian
methods to abstain awhile to allow the body to rest, to rejuvenate etc.
Not the Nazarene man! Glad mine has a heart and knows self control.
Probably last place this belongs. Who knows if it will make it up and
who cares. Be real people, nothing separates you guys from the world.
In fact you have it worse because you believe your works are making
some impact on God. At least the people who have no clue don't mock Him
with their boastfulness. They are more inclined to be taken by "I do
not set aside the Grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained
through the law, Christ died for nothing!". Gal 2:21.
Ah, no point
in speaking of coverings etc. if you don't trust fully in Jesus for
salvation. Ain't no working that will get you there of your own accord.
is impartial and does not take more delight from one, then from
another. He loves us all :) Stop trying so hard, no one will be one
over by it as only Jesus saves!! Not religion and definitely not the
works of the law. Ah, about the court. How convenient as it hides the
deeds and misdoings of those in the wrong! Don't you believe for a
minute that people admire lies. We bare witness by leaving and sharing
with others (psychologists included to counteract the mental anguish
endured for decades) the real nature of the church.
Love your own like crazy and ostracise any who leave or question..
Yeah, no fooling people there.
Reply to comment No.7: Yes, God
does love us all. Do we love one another?
5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we
were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
am not pretending. Why do you think that I am? Salvation can be lost,
(by sin). So I cannot agree with your comment that, "it is never taken
away". More accurately, "It is never taken away, as long as we live
according to the Word of God."
of course, I do not agree with the attitude of rejecting anyone.
Peter Ch.2 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as
there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in
damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring
upon themselves swift destruction.
many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of
truth shall be evil spoken of.
through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of
you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their
damnation slumbereth not.
things are happening now. If cannot be that the Word of God be not
the person who wrote comment number 7 on 20 August 2013, have a look at
1 Jn 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not;
1 Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin;
1 Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not;
I not only have joy, but also peace in my heart. And I would like you
to have that too.
a person sins everyday, such a person is a sinner. Does a sinner have
eternal life abiding in him? Read Romans 6 in the King James version.
previous "sin comments", I think we must realise that some define sin
differently than other Christians. In the ACC faith, it is very
ingrained in all, no, we do not sin as members, and others would get
mighty offended to label THEIR WEAKENESS AS SIN. But let us try to be a
little objective and not subjective, boys and girls... read on...
you blow your top, and say unkind words, a Christian may say this is a
weakness. Other Christian, may do the exact same thing, and call this a
sin. All unrighteousness is sin. What about lack of trust, and faith
and belief in God? Definitely not an acceptable thing in the eyes of
God, and how many Christians fall into this sin again and
As a Christian..?
This sounds pretty sinful to me, because
these qualities do not honour God, and in effect you are saying, "God,
I don't think you can help me." What about unbelief in God
you, who possess the Holy Spirit) that He cannot help you with your
impossible issues, including your grudge with this website? Do not
I am learning a very very interesting thing.
People who perhaps are not acting perfect are condemned as disobedient
Christians, but the persons judging them can be sinning the greater sin
because of their unloving judgemental "get away from me - you diseased
NO HOPE sheep!" attitude. Any soul that knows of someone expelled in
their own family, will grieve and cry, and even try to "restore" them,
because they love them so much. Hello?? Would God not do EVEN MORE? We
must stop thinking that God thinks and loves like us.
prodigal son story... the other brother was all grizzly and unforgiving
even though he had been the good boy and stayed home. Remember,
prodigal sons and daughters can come home to God more than once. Only
men shove them in the bin, and never take them out again. God doesn't
do this. He looks for the lost baptised sheep, and brings them back if
Do not be offended if someone says they still sin
as a Christian because they may be defining sin differently than you,
and not only that, some may sin, but God still forgives them. In a
church of the ACC faith, when they prepared souls for baptism, if they
were asked the question do you still sin, they were told to say yes.
Others were offended by this... how can you say you still
Well, guess what? Read on... I like this definition of sin:
is any deliberate action, attitude, or thought that goes against God.
You may think of sin as an obvious act, such as murder, adultery, or
theft. Although that's true, sin is also wrongdoing that's far subtler
and even unnoticeable at times, such as pride, envy, or even worry. Sin
includes both things you shouldn't have done, but did (sins of
commission) and things you should've done, but didn't (sins of
omission)". (from dummies.com)
think I would prefer to be more truthful and say, I still sin as a
Christian from time to time. A "weakness" label can be hand crafted by
the enemy to make you look holier than you are, and make it look not so
bad, when in actual fact, your offence still stinks in the nostrils of
God. Ummm, interesting...
20th August, comment 8.
Seeing as no one can measure up and follow the Word of God
without blemish, all have lost their salvation??
John 1:8-10 says. If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves
and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and
just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all
unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be
a liar and his word has no place in our lives. This was written to the
believing church and therein shows that they held themselves still as
sinners, forgiven in Jesus.
As for falling away. It just does
not happen and when it appears to it goes on to say that this was to
show that they were never of the elect.
Please take a moment
to read from Romans 8:28 through to the end of Romans 9. It speaks of
God being the chooser and that He will choose according to his will.
11:5-7 So too, at the present time there is a remnant chosen by grace.
And if by grace, then it is no longer by works; if it were, grace would
longer be grace. What then? What Israel sought so earnestly it did not
obtain, but the elect did. The others were hardened,
9:14-24 What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all! For He says
to Moses, "I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have
compassion on whom I have compassion." It does not, therefore, depend
on man's desire or effort, but on God's mercy. For the Scripture says
to Pharoah: "I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might
display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the
earth." Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he
hardens whom he wants to harden.
One of you will say to me:
"Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?" But, who
are you, O man, to talk back to God? "Shall what is formed say to him
who formed it, 'Why did you make me like this?' "does not the potter
have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for
noble purposes and some for common use? What if God, choosing to show
his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the
objects if his wrath-prepared for destruction? What if he did this to
make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he
prepared in advance for glory - even is, whom he also called, not only
from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?
The subject here is
that we who believe have been purposed for this not by our own doing.
The Bible states that God grants repentance. It is given when he
decides and to whom he chooses not because of their own deeds but
because that's his calling for that person.
20, comment 11.
Yay! A God given response.
I'm the person that wrote the original message and comment 7 and a
couple of others.
tone of those who seek to shame one who confesses to being a sinner is
disheartening. However, it is from God to discard our own righteousness
and take on God's righteousness so that's all ok. I am glad this is all
being talked about. There will never be a day when calling sin
something less is OK. For over 3 decades I have witnessed the lives of
the church goers and those nearest and dearest have covered many things
by calling them shortcomings instead of sin. Because of the witness
that people bare one cannot be convinced that those shortcomings are
anything but sins and with relief I say I have peace beyond compare and
that's why I can call it what it is. I am not afraid that God will walk
away or shame me.
The prodigal son, now that is the heart of God. He
runs for the one that is not worthy and offends the one who would
appear righteous. Isn't God good, that his love knows no bounds.
Rest assured that all who call on the name of The Lord shall be saved.
don't feel the need to waste time on verses that seek to shame people
who confess they are sinners. God declares he is faithful and just to
forgive and he is the only judge that matters. Do any of you feel like
those present at the woman's stoning? Please note that Jesus said "Let
him who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at her".
As no one is sinless who lives in the flesh, there is no need for the
throwing about of guilt. Surely we've all endured this pointless and
unjustified condemnation for too many decades. Jesus saves, works
condem us because we can never do enough.
to add to comment 11. I
totally agree that we must not insult God. PS: If you
me to "in effect" mean (that I don't think God can help me), I'm sorry
but you have completely missed my message. Now in regards
some of the things that you wrote, there are some things that I agree
with you. And there are some things that you wrote which I don't agree
with you. Simmer down. I don't think that getting upset helps.
John 4:1: Beloved, believe not
every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many
false prophets are gone out into the world.
1 John 4:21: And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth
God love his brother also.
the point of being baptized if we are going to continue sinning?
6:1-4: What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may
abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer
therein? Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus
Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him
by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead
by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of
1 Peter 2:24: Who his own self bare our sins in his
own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto
righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.
All that is written in The Holy Scriptures is true and correct.
1 John 3:6: Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not:
1 John 3:9: Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin;
Romans 8:10: And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin;
but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
the person who wrote comment number 7.
wrote: It's a mockery of God to say you all have no sin,
but not sin after baptism. So how do you interpret 1 John 3:9 Whosoever
is born of God doth not commit sin; ??
According to the Word of God
in Romans 6:19, weaknesses do exists. (I suppose we should use the word
"infirmity" rather than "weakness".)
I speak after the manner of men
because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your
members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so
now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
How close are the meanings of these two words, "infirmity" &
6:20 For when ye "WERE" the servants of sin, ye were free from
righteousness. The word "were" indicates in time past ie: before
"But now" refers to the time "after" baptism.
6:22 "But now" being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye
have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
Romans 6:19 proves that there IS a thing called "infirmity" or
to the person who
mentioned Luke 15:27-32 And he said unto him, Thy brother is come; and
thy father hath killed the fatted calf, because he hath received him
safe and sound. And he was angry, and would not go in: therefore came
his father out, and intreated him. And he answering said to his father,
Lo, these many years do I serve thee, neither transgressed I at any
time thy commandment: and yet thou never gavest me a kid, that I might
make merry with my friends: But as soon as this thy son was come, which
hath devoured thy living with harlots, thou hast killed for him the
fatted calf. And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all
that I have is thine. It was meet that we should make merry, and be
glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost,
and is found.
IF WE WERE THAT OLDER BROTHER, WOULD WE GO
IN TO BE MERRY WITH THE LOST BROTHER WHO RETURNED? OR WOULD WE
INSISTENTLY CONTINUE TO SHOW DISSATISFACTION. WOULD WE SOFTEN OUR HEART
AND ACCEPT OUR LOST BROTHERS RETURN? OR WOULD WE INSIST OUR
Jonah 4:8-11 And it came to pass, when the
sun did arise, that God prepared a vehement east wind; and the sun beat
upon the head of Jonah, that he fainted, and wished in himself to die,
and said, It is better for me to die than to live. And God said to
Jonah, Doest thou well to be angry for the gourd? And he said, I do
well to be angry, even unto death. Then said the LORD, Thou hast had
pity on the gourd, for the which thou hast not laboured, neither madest
it grow; which came up in a night, and perished in a night: And should
not I spare Nineveh, that great city, wherein are more than sixscore
thousand persons that cannot discern between their right hand and their
left hand; and also much cattle?
IF YOU WERE IN JONAH'S
SHOES, WOULD YOU BE HAPPY THAT THE PEOPLE OF NINEVEH REPENTED? OR WOULD
WE INSISTENTLY CONTINUE TO SHOW DISSATISFACTION? WOULD WE SOFTEN OUR
HEART AND ACCEPT THEIR REPENTANCE? OR WOULD WE INSIST OUR OWN
- TOPIC CLOSED, THANK YOU -