| Spiritual and Mental Abuse in ACCN in Australia - Page 13 |
1 September 2013 - Record 6,272 visits in August
August
was the new record month. We have recorder the total of 6,272 visits,
907 unique visitors and 11,936 pageviews. All up, 226 cities around the
world, and these are the first 100 cities:
Melbourne 1,956, Brisbane 1,380, Sydney 560, Salem 279, Cleveland 224, Sterling Heights 163, Adelaide 143, Monument 94, Parma 89, Kitchener 83, Perth 76, Fairlawn 76, Wadsworth 75, Charter Township of Clinton 70, Windsor 54, Los Angeles 50, Middleburg Heights 36, Montrose-Ghent 34, Golden Valley 33, Washington 32, Brunswick 32, Berea 30, Rittman 26, Waterloo 22, Toronto 21, Sharon Center 21, Monmouth 21, (not set) 20, San Diego 19, Colorado Springs 18, Markham 16, Chicago 16, Medina 16, Baja 15, Cape Canaveral 13, Oberlin 13, Cairns 12, Wetzlar 12, Stow 12, LaSalle 12, Roseville 11, New York 10, Akron 10, Independence 10, Columbus 9, Bloomfield Township 9, Escondido 8, Bloomington 8, Detroit 8, Kuala Lumpur 7, Eastvale 7, Montreal 6, Pecs 6, Veszprem 6, Newton 6, Pittsburgh 6, Woodstock 5, Giessen 5, Hemet 5, Santa Ana 5, Torrance 5, Mediapolis 5, Novi Sad 5, Brant 5, Rockhampton 4, Townsville 4, Marburg 4, Jakarta 4, Bath 4, Strongsville 4, Dallas 4, Leamington 3, Depok 3, Petaling Jaya 3, Corona 3, Pembroke Pines 3, Wheaton 3, Troy 3, Hudson 3, Eugene 3, Alexandria 3, Belgrade 3, Laichingen 3, Numbrecht 3, Darwin 2, Cambridge 2, Guelph 2, London 2, Mississauga 2, Abidjan 2, Horb am Neckar 2, Surabaya 2, Auckland 2, Irvine 2, Moorpark 2, San Francisco 2, Boca Raton 2, Naples 2, Geneva 2, and Louisville 2 visits.
Melbourne 1,956, Brisbane 1,380, Sydney 560, Salem 279, Cleveland 224, Sterling Heights 163, Adelaide 143, Monument 94, Parma 89, Kitchener 83, Perth 76, Fairlawn 76, Wadsworth 75, Charter Township of Clinton 70, Windsor 54, Los Angeles 50, Middleburg Heights 36, Montrose-Ghent 34, Golden Valley 33, Washington 32, Brunswick 32, Berea 30, Rittman 26, Waterloo 22, Toronto 21, Sharon Center 21, Monmouth 21, (not set) 20, San Diego 19, Colorado Springs 18, Markham 16, Chicago 16, Medina 16, Baja 15, Cape Canaveral 13, Oberlin 13, Cairns 12, Wetzlar 12, Stow 12, LaSalle 12, Roseville 11, New York 10, Akron 10, Independence 10, Columbus 9, Bloomfield Township 9, Escondido 8, Bloomington 8, Detroit 8, Kuala Lumpur 7, Eastvale 7, Montreal 6, Pecs 6, Veszprem 6, Newton 6, Pittsburgh 6, Woodstock 5, Giessen 5, Hemet 5, Santa Ana 5, Torrance 5, Mediapolis 5, Novi Sad 5, Brant 5, Rockhampton 4, Townsville 4, Marburg 4, Jakarta 4, Bath 4, Strongsville 4, Dallas 4, Leamington 3, Depok 3, Petaling Jaya 3, Corona 3, Pembroke Pines 3, Wheaton 3, Troy 3, Hudson 3, Eugene 3, Alexandria 3, Belgrade 3, Laichingen 3, Numbrecht 3, Darwin 2, Cambridge 2, Guelph 2, London 2, Mississauga 2, Abidjan 2, Horb am Neckar 2, Surabaya 2, Auckland 2, Irvine 2, Moorpark 2, San Francisco 2, Boca Raton 2, Naples 2, Geneva 2, and Louisville 2 visits.
29 August 2013 - "God does not care about title", sent by a reader
 |
o | I think it's very wrong what Paul Pentsa and others are doing, taking members of the church to court. It's the ultimate affront to our Christian belief and it's a disgrace to the Nazarene Church!! This action: "brother taking brother to court" is very wrong in the eyes of God, and for this action they will be held accountable!!! It doesn't matter what you call yourself, whether pastor, prophet, teacher, elder, you will all stand before the judgement seat of God and He will ask you how you treated your fellow man?? Did you give a drink to those who were thirsty (this can also be in the spiritual sense), did you feed the hungry and help the needy?? (Matthew 25:31-46) This is what God will demand from you, not how many churches you own and how big a kingdom you built for yourself!! It's how you treated your fellow man. Did you cheat him out of his possessions?? Did you defraud him?? Did you take what does not legally belong to you?? These are all questions God will ask you. It doesn't matter what you call yourself, God doesn't care about your title and position... He looks at your heart!! Is it good or is it evil? That is the question. |
COMMENT 1:
Paul Pentsa, please read this: from 1 Corinthians 6: Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?
Vrs:5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?
Vrs:6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers.
Vrs:7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? why do ye not rather suffer yourselves to be defrauded?
Vrs:8 Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren.
Vrs:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers,... Nor thieves, nor covetous,... nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
Paul Pentsa, there is utterly a fault among you, because you go to law brother with brother. Why don't you rather suffer monetary or earthy loss?? That's what the Word of God teaches us. Do you want to follow the Word of God? Or is property and monetary gain more important to you?
It should be very clear to all that Paul Pentsa as an elder is doing wrong by going to court: "Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren. Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?"
Behold what the Bible says: Brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. Rom 16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
(For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: Php 3:19 Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)
OUR COMMENT: Nice,
but you are just wasting your time. Paul Pentsa listens only to one
person - that person is Paul Pentsa. He did not even respect the
authority of the judge in the Supreme Court. He was on the stand on
Wednesday and after a while started arguing with the judge, saying
things like "You have your laws, but we have ours. Our laws are above
your laws!" And: "I have the power to baptize and the power to expel."
That was the "classic" Paul Pentsa - stubborn, arrogant, disrespectful,
malicious. The judge did not like how he acted. Overall, the whole
thing was more than embarrassing. Lincu, Kovacevic and Pentsa presented
themselves as rude and ignorant people disconnected from the real
world. Paul Pentsa probably thought - "Oh, I'm an elder, the judge will
only want to listen to me." Of course, the judge, who was very good,
everyone agrees on that, was rather interested in facts and documents.
We do not know what will happen next. Now when the hearing is finished,
the judge needs to come with some decision. This may take some time, a
few weeks or longer, we'll see.
COMMENT
2: Did Pentsa really say "our laws are above your laws"???? That is HILARIOUS, wow like the judge actually cares about what some unknown church's "laws" are. Let me know if he actually said this or if you just paraphrased.
OUR COMMENT: It's
pretty much what he said. Yes, it is funny, in a way. You do not go to
the court of justice to ask for help, and then say something like that.
It brings us back to what we said many times on this website - Paul
Pentsa is a man who lost the plot. He does not have the ability to see
himself. He thinks the whole world is revolving around HIM. It's
something like, yeah, the Bible is the ultimate truth, and we are the
only church that follows that truth properly, and I am the elder of
that church, hence, I am the Master of the Universe and everyone must
obey me. Pentsa even started explaining why no other elder wants to
work with him, he mentioned Arnold's name and why they are not together
anymore, etc, etc.. just ridiculous. And sick. What to say? It looks
very sad that in this day and age we have people in our church who
allowed themselves to be reduced to a sub-human level by Paul, Janko
and few other control freaks, having no courage to stand up and say
"enough!" This is beyond hope. Plain and simple, the Nazarene church as
we knew ceased to exist.
COMMENT
3: ELDER DAVE, TAKE SWIFT ACTION. ELDER DAVE A TRUE SHEPHERD OF JESUS CHRIST GO TO AUSTRALIA AND SOUGHT IT OUT ONCE AND FOR ALL. THE FOXES WILL FAIL. PRAY ALWAYS AMEN.
COMMENT 4:
How disgraceful Paul! What is wrong with the elders in the US & Canada? How can they all be so ignorant? Make the humble minister Cucanic an elder in Australia and disregard all cult leaders. This is embarrassing!!
COMMENT 5:
I am same person that wrote comment 2. If you're allowed to say, what reasons was he giving that no elder wants to work with him? Did he puff himself up; like I'm the only good one left, or something like that?? It's so rediculous that it's commical that he doesn't see that he's just making a fool of himself. I wonder what the court thought with a room full of our people. Probably everyone was thinking: who in the world are these clowns?
OUR COMMENT: Well,
you should have seen Matea and Kovacevic, they were even worse, much
worse than Paul. Both came to court dressed like they were going to the
flea market, Matea in a red jumper and Kovacevic in a black leather
jacket. The proceeding is organized around the affidavits the two sides
provided to the court, but it seemed like Matea and Kovacevic have not
even read them. Laza's barrister asked Matea many times to read certain
lines from his own affidavits. It was like, "Mr. Lincu, could you
please find the page that and that in your affidavit and read the line
that and that?" Matea would slowly find it, read it, and the barrister
would then tell him "Mr. Lincu, this contradicts what you've
just
said." That happened at least 6 or 7 times. Matea was offered some
hearing aid, which did not work at the end, and Kovacevic needed a
translator.
COMMENT
6: In regards to the court case. Why should people steal and not be accountable? Where is the punishment for the one taking someone else's things? There is no shame on righting wrongs. Should we all take from each other and then throw around bible versus about taking monetary loss? Not Ok! Return what belongs one to another rather then justify ones sins and forget to account for another's.
OUR COMMENT: You
obviously did not follow this conflict from the beginning. Matea first
agreed to let Laza pay all the bills for the church in Arncliffe. Then
he signed the transfer of his part of the church to Laza. He was asked
on the court: "Is this your signature?" "Yes." "Do you remember signing
these papers?" "Yes." "Did you read the papers before signing them?"
"No." (Laughter in the courtroom.) That was in 2004. Five years later,
the majority of members in Arncliffe got sick of Matea and his
disgraceful life. This is when the real conflict had begun. In 2010
they signed a letter
sacking Matea and cutting the ties with Paul
Pentsa. The whole thing is not about property at all. It is about
people's resistance to Paul Pentsa and his puppet Matea.
Oh, yes. Another detail. Paul Pentsa mentioned, when his was on the stand, that he may decide to LIQUIDATE (??) the church in Altona, in order to punish those disobedient members who did not let him sell it. It is not quite clear what he meant.
Oh, yes. Another detail. Paul Pentsa mentioned, when his was on the stand, that he may decide to LIQUIDATE (??) the church in Altona, in order to punish those disobedient members who did not let him sell it. It is not quite clear what he meant.
COMMENT 7:
I think anyone who has common sense and knowledge, knows that judges in a court are only interested in the legal facts and documents, as mentioned above. Judges do not care what we do in our church. They do not care what our "laws" are, or if we baptize, expel, etc. Judges are only interested in the law of the land and government, and if there has been any breach of law, contracts, facts, etc. Judges make a decision based on things like that, not on laws of a church.
COMMENT 8:
Hi, I've noticed numerous comments condemning an elder who, in front of the congregation, told a brother who had sinned that he "should be ashamed" of what he had done. Everyone here seems very apt at locating the passage about not taking brothers to court, but why doesn't anyone on this site seem to know about the verse that says "Them that sin rebuke before all that others may fear"? Isn't it pretty obvious that's what the elder was doing? Just asking.
COMMENT 9:
Comment 6: your question was why to thow around Bible verses about taking loss and not going to court when someone wrongs you. Ummmmmm maybe because its Jesus' commandments? Do you know anything about the Bible? Its HORRIBLE what Paul is doing to take them to the court!!! LIQUIDATE THE CHURCH??? Oh my goodness. I have yet not heard something so horrific. Just because they did not want to sell. In other words, he likely meant he will excommunicate the whole church from the Nazarene church. WOW. Sounds like your matters in Australia are only beginning.
COMMENT 10:
To Comment #6: your comment is we have to return what has been stolen that is true for it is according to the word of God. Please let me ask you can Paul Pentsa return to Laza Krnjulac and his family what Paul Pentsa stole from Laza 13 plus years of suffering, humiliation, excommunication for Paul Pentsa's family revenge, for his nephew Robert. If Paul Pentsa can return all this what Paul did to Laza i believe Laza would return the church.
COMMENT 11:
You are an insignificant person Pentsa, from an insignificant church, to say you have your own laws and the power to baptise and expel are the words of a dictator running a cult. Would your fearful followers do everything you ask for fear they may disciplined or expelled? Grow some guts Nazarenes and overthrow this dictator, it's not that hard, they have already done it in Libya and Iraq. Pensta your days are numbered, your people will be free once you are ousted.
COMMENT 12:
Greetings website and all its readers! I have just received awful news from Melbourne. I hear that there are TWO buyers for the Melbourne church waiting and that there indeed is nothing stopping the sale. I was very shaken with this news and I hope that it is not true!! Please website: somehow find out what is going on and Melbourne church: Gird your armour on and get ready for war! Don't let Pentsa win! Why don’t you people in Melbourne get together already and oust this dictator?? When you lose your church soon -OR- if he liquidates it, what are you going to do?! I CANNOT BELIEVE what Pentsa is like, even after reading this site for months, but now when I hear that he wants to SHUT DOWN a church because they won’t sell, this is a HUGE sin!! Don’t let it be sold and get rid of Paul already!!! I just hope to myself that it’s not true that it will be sold, but these Melbourne people wouldn’t make up the story! Why don’t you American elders DO SOMETHING about this situation??? Aren’t you afraid of God?? Or is all you care about your chairs?? These people are on the brink of having nowhere left to worship!!!
COMMENT 13:
Seriously?? Comment 10 are you saying that Laza was excommunicated because his daughter left Paul Pentsa’s nephew Robert? And just as bad, Matea is still in support of Pentsa? This is beyond Spiritual abuse. What kind of guts does Pentsa have to tell the court "our laws are above your laws?" That just plainly shows the arrogance of that man. He really does see himself as the god of Australia. There is not stopping this evil dictator. American/Canadian elders you too will reap what this man is sowing because you are sitting back and allowing it to happen. Oh, but you think going to Africa to feed a few hungry is going to help. According to the Bible it will not help you. It is not too late to step in and take action. They are pleading for help and you are sitting back allowing them to suffer. You yourselves wrote a letter that Paul has not kept his promise as he promised to the elder body, but you won't take action because you all are in a club and don't want to lose your spot. Remember this, God is watching us all but especially you who have an oversight of the children of God.
 |
| It's
time to go... |
| 28
August
2013 - COLUMBIA STATION, OHIO There
days we are being flooded with messages and comments related to the
Columbia Station church in Ohio. Many of these messages seem to be
confusing and contradictional. Putting them on the website just like
that makes our website confusing too, which has already been brought to
our attention. If the readers are keen on discussing the Columbia
Station issues, then we would have to start from the beginning, i.e. we
would first have to explain the following:
- How big is this congregation? - What is the structure of this congregation (age, nationality, etc. of its members)? - Is this congregation conservative or liberal? - Who is their elder and who are the ministers? - What is the history of problems and what are the current issues? - Are there elements of spiritual and mental abuse? (which is this site's focus) If somebody from Ohio, let’s say, is willing to provide the answers to these questions, as a starting point, then we would be able to post more comments and questions related to the Columbia Station church. Otherwise, there is no point of sending more and more comments that readers outside of Ohio and the USA cannot follow. Thank you. CLICK HERE TO CONTINUE READING >> |
25 August 2013 - "Giving a voice to all", sent by a reader
Yes
the website is a bit confusing to follow, it would be good if all the
comments would appear in the order that they are sent, maybe just a
small date and time underneath them. But either way it's still a great
website, because people can finally share what's on their heart without
being judged for it because no one knows who they are!! It's awesome!!
Finally giving a voice to all who've been told all their lives
to
"shush up" or "get out". Thank you :) One more little thing, it be
great if we could "like" or "unlike" comments. Just an idea :)
24 August 2013 - "FALSE vs TRUE repentance", sent by a reader
FALSE = 1 Sam 26:21
(example of confession), Yet 1 Sam 28:6-18 (Saul continues in
sin)
TRUE = Ezra 10:1-17 example (confession and fruit of repentance)
Elder Paul Pentsa sought forgiveness the Sunday before the baptism, in front of the MARSDEN church. What about in front of Melbourne or Sydney churches? He is justifying (brother taking brother to court) on the court cases proceeding on these 2 churches, not on Marsden church. (Yet he might say the solicitor is doing it, not me, so it's OK.)
Confessing your sin without fruit of repentance has ZERO value in God's eyes. Care factor ZERO! And seeking forgiveness at the wrong locations is even more INVALID.
COMMENT 1:
For the statement written on 24 August:
What each person sows, that will he/she reap.
There's a lack of "fear" of the Lord.
Can we find an elders who:
- will not be bribed
- will not have respect of person. James 2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin,
- will justly show equity to all
- will not do anything without prior approved from the Church
- speak & treat everyone in a respectable way (not mocking anyone)
- will not punish the innocent
- will not permit those who are guilty of sin to go unpunished
- perhaps you could add some more
TRUE = Ezra 10:1-17 example (confession and fruit of repentance)
Elder Paul Pentsa sought forgiveness the Sunday before the baptism, in front of the MARSDEN church. What about in front of Melbourne or Sydney churches? He is justifying (brother taking brother to court) on the court cases proceeding on these 2 churches, not on Marsden church. (Yet he might say the solicitor is doing it, not me, so it's OK.)
Confessing your sin without fruit of repentance has ZERO value in God's eyes. Care factor ZERO! And seeking forgiveness at the wrong locations is even more INVALID.
COMMENT 1:
For the statement written on 24 August:
What each person sows, that will he/she reap.
There's a lack of "fear" of the Lord.
Can we find an elders who:
- will not be bribed
- will not have respect of person. James 2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin,
- will justly show equity to all
- will not do anything without prior approved from the Church
- speak & treat everyone in a respectable way (not mocking anyone)
- will not punish the innocent
- will not permit those who are guilty of sin to go unpunished
- perhaps you could add some more
23 August 2013 - "Your website is still not good", sent by a reader
Dear
website people: I know you are trying hard to make this website easier
to read, but it is still not very good. You have now put the new thing
on "click here to continue reading" under certain topics. Well, now,
instead of scrolling down to see if there is something new, we now have
to "click" into each section and scroll to the bottom of each section
to see if anything is new and if we missed anything. This is no
different. If you put 10 sections on here, we will now have to click
into all 10 sections that says "click here to continue reading", and
that is just as bad as before. Is it really so hard to just put all the
comments in under one day and date? I mean can't you just put today's
date, and all the comments that you have received for that day? I
understand that you want to keep the different topics separate and all
the comments for that topic together, but it is still too time
consuming to now have to click into each section, and see what is
written. Sorry, but just think there has to be an easier way to read
this site.
All you really need is "footnote" on the topic to show us what the comment pertains to. We will then read the footnote, and realize that oh Okay, this comment is pertaining to "You are a self centred group", something like that. I'm not telling you what to do, but now instead of scrolling down to see if anything is new, we now have to go into each section that says "click here to continue reading", and then scroll down. That means every day we go into it, or each time per day we go into the site, we have to go into each section that says "click here to continue reading". It's like going over & over everything so many times. What if you had 20 sections? Then we would have to go into all 20 sections every time we go on the website. Anyway, your all, and sorry for this, but there has to be a better way.
COMMENT 1:
Message to the CEO of this site: I have noticed that you do not place all messages sent to this site for all to read. Messages, especially those explaining Bible verses should BE placed onto this site. I am very quickly losing trust in you because of your filtering choices as what to place and what not to place on this site. To be fair you should place BOTH for and against opinions. Or, is freedom of speech not permitted on this site? You have permitted a number of harshly worded messages to be listed, you should post online BOTH for and against opinions. If someone wrote something beneficial, then by all means you should list it, especially if it's from the Bible. I'm worried that only one sided comments are listed. If it is only one sided (as it appears to me to be) that is not justice. (Naturally you should though forbid swearing etc.)
COMMENT 2:
Sorry, but this website looks like a mishap. It's just so hard to read and all mixed up. I don't think I want to read it anymore.
COMMENT 3:
I agree that the problems are coming from elders. Most elders. But not all elders. I would like to know (unbiased information please) what's with Colombia Station? As for mental illnesses, I don't believe we can understand them and we should leave it for the Lord. Let the Lord decide how much such a person is knowingly sinning or not.
COMMENT 4:
Re. Columbia Station issue. The secret ballot is new to the Nazarene Faith. It was never practised like this way in Europe or North American. Secretive ways of church practise among members in the fellowship is not what Jesus taught or practised with his disciples or commanded his apostles to carry down to the next followers.
If there is anything in the fellowship that needs to be addressed/discussed and/or brought to some conclusion or decision, the correct way is NOT secretive. An open discussion and free to prove what you are saying or teaching is having true love and care towards each member. Having secret love is not Biblical. What is there to hide? If you have something to bring before the church and the fellowship, the Nazarene Faith was such (having servants in the church not lords) where every member was free to bring it up. Now, you have to go via the minister/elder for approval, and if they find it fit, they will bring it up; you don’t have the right to stand up and bring something what you’re Faith and what the Holy Spirit is guiding or teaching you. This is a wrong change in the Nazarene Faith. If there was a need for another ministering brother, the church would discuss about it, would pray about it and members were open to propose who they believed was fit for that role. AND, they had to prove BIBLICALLY why. Or, if he was not fit, again, members were open to prove again, BIBLICALLY why not!
It was never practised through secret ballot. This is something new. Because for many years some churches have practised it this way, it seems as if it’s somewhat now normal. This is a political way to practise not a Christian way or a Biblical way. We will be quick to state The Acts 1:26 (they cast lots). It could have been a Jewish custom then, but it doesn’t give us a teaching to practise it this way. Plus casting lots has nothing to do with ballots anyway.
Stating your guidance of the Holy Spirit should not be secretive. Stating your belief in word or by deed (maybe one way is by standing up), openly, is what we need to do. Open rebuke is better than secret love. Proverbs 27:5. Open rebuke is not being secretive.
People seem upset with Elder Dave because he is working with the church at Columbia Station, and not acting as a lord over that church. Why did the people leave? Why did they all leave when they heard the elders were coming to Columbia Station?
COMMENT 5:
Hey dude, if secretive ways are wrong, then how come you didn't write your name with your comment?
Columbia Station is a mess. And right now someone from there is saying... "this is the best Nazarene church in the world." Who caused the mess? Dave. That whole church should have been put under discipline until peace was made. But rather Dave took sides and tore the church to pieces.
COMMENT 6:
You people are a disgrace to the Body of Christ. Why don't you simply leave the cult of the "nazarene" church. Oh that's right, you can't because it's the only true church on earth right and everyone else is going to hell. Grow up and get out.
COMMENT 7:
To the comment that said it's not fair that they're not putting everything: I agree. Even if we don't agree with them, everyone should be given an equal chance to jump on each other's throats.
To the comment that said leave the cult of the Nazarene church... why? Why are you being so ruthless to our beloved church? We all love our church dearly or we wouldn't be in it. Just because there are bad apples doesn't mean the whole church is rotten. I truly believe that the truth is PREACHED in our church. Does everyone live it? ABSOLUTELY NOT. Do MOST live it? Even that is a "probably not." But we strive. I believe every single one of us wants ourselves AND our church to be better. What do you mean "all others are going to hell?" Nobody on here EVER said that (to my knowledge). We don't wish to be deceived. There are churches out there that preach all kinds of false doctrines. Nothing false is preached from ours. Do we live it?? Well with God's help we strive, but no, we are actually far from living it. But at least we are exposed to the full undiluted Gospel of Jesus Christ. Sorry, but I was kind of hurt by your comment of putting the Nazarene church down so bad. Sounds to me like you rebelled and the church didn't like it so now we're a "cult"... maybe you should grow up and come back instead of telling us to grow up and leave. We have no reason to leave. This is all we know and we know the truth is preached here.
COMMENT 9:
To comment 5 writer: We were talking about the voting/ballot/political ways that ‘men that have crept in’ have changed the Nazarene Faith to the way it was practised.
We can discuss the issue on why people don’t put their names down with their comments, but we were not discussing this. We were commenting on the secretive work of the church with its members as practised in some churches.
Can you please prove how ‘Elder Dave took sides and tore the church in pieces’ please?
COMMENT 10:
I understand the court case for the Sydney church is tomorrow, Aug. 26th. Please keep us updated if you can.
COMMENT 11:
Columbia station is a better place now, thanks for your concerns. The problems have all left.
COMMENT 12:
Comment 8: regarding your comment to #6 as to leaving the church. Whoever wrote that comment has the right to feel that way. Perhaps in knowing that the truth shall set them free they are aware that the gospel being preached in the church is that of the law and it sets aside the gospel of grace. That is not the gospel. Comment 6 is how so many feel the church behaves. As for trying to make out they were rebellious, they are the lucky one as the shackles that come with the false gospel need to be broken. The law was your school master until you came to grace. Even if you feel the truth is being taught, it is of no value to you if you are not enlightened to Jesus and his work on the cross. It's obvious from your comment that you are inclined toward works and this is unbiblical as it denounces Christ as being enough for salvation. It's OK if your hurt in the process of the truth being revealed. The church hurts so many and its so great to see it being shown for the sect/cult/religion that it is. It was given that label in Yugo by the media and stated that it was very dangerous to young people. As The Lord has not yet opened your eyes you do not see it. Rejoice all you who feel this way because it is true that the church is not spiritually healthy and does not seek Jesus rather their own works based salvation. You will know the truth and the truth shall set you free, and you will be free indeed. Do not assume that comment 6 is blinded, many many of us feel exactly the same and praise the good Lord for the unveiling of this truth. Amen!
COMMENT 13:
Comment 5 wrote Columbia station is a mess and comment 11 says it's a great place, seems to me the mess has been cleaned out.
COMMENT 14:
Comment 12, I would like to know WHAT we teach that is "works-based" and what we teach that is not in the Bible? It's not all about "grace." YES absolutely we are saved by grace, but taking advantage of grace as an excuse that we can do whatever and it doesn't matter what is taught from the pulpit is a GRIEVOUS sin. And I don't think even one Nazarene feels that it is by our own works that we are saved. "If you love me, you will keep my commandments." That's what Jesus says. I honestly do not believe that anything we teach in Nazarene church is not either directly from the Gospels or what the apostles wrote. And yes, of course the media in Yugo said that. That means it's right?? We judge our faith but what the world says of us?? Because we are different and don't follow what the crkva says? If that's what we judge our faith by, and try to make it to the world's liking... "tesko nama svima."
COMMENT 15:
"Columbia S. is the best church in the world." We all know who said this... the same one who blasts everyone as "no good." Only the group of 15-20 left at CS are good.
All you really need is "footnote" on the topic to show us what the comment pertains to. We will then read the footnote, and realize that oh Okay, this comment is pertaining to "You are a self centred group", something like that. I'm not telling you what to do, but now instead of scrolling down to see if anything is new, we now have to go into each section that says "click here to continue reading", and then scroll down. That means every day we go into it, or each time per day we go into the site, we have to go into each section that says "click here to continue reading". It's like going over & over everything so many times. What if you had 20 sections? Then we would have to go into all 20 sections every time we go on the website. Anyway, your all, and sorry for this, but there has to be a better way.
COMMENT 1:
Message to the CEO of this site: I have noticed that you do not place all messages sent to this site for all to read. Messages, especially those explaining Bible verses should BE placed onto this site. I am very quickly losing trust in you because of your filtering choices as what to place and what not to place on this site. To be fair you should place BOTH for and against opinions. Or, is freedom of speech not permitted on this site? You have permitted a number of harshly worded messages to be listed, you should post online BOTH for and against opinions. If someone wrote something beneficial, then by all means you should list it, especially if it's from the Bible. I'm worried that only one sided comments are listed. If it is only one sided (as it appears to me to be) that is not justice. (Naturally you should though forbid swearing etc.)
COMMENT 2:
Sorry, but this website looks like a mishap. It's just so hard to read and all mixed up. I don't think I want to read it anymore.
COMMENT 3:
I agree that the problems are coming from elders. Most elders. But not all elders. I would like to know (unbiased information please) what's with Colombia Station? As for mental illnesses, I don't believe we can understand them and we should leave it for the Lord. Let the Lord decide how much such a person is knowingly sinning or not.
COMMENT 4:
Re. Columbia Station issue. The secret ballot is new to the Nazarene Faith. It was never practised like this way in Europe or North American. Secretive ways of church practise among members in the fellowship is not what Jesus taught or practised with his disciples or commanded his apostles to carry down to the next followers.
If there is anything in the fellowship that needs to be addressed/discussed and/or brought to some conclusion or decision, the correct way is NOT secretive. An open discussion and free to prove what you are saying or teaching is having true love and care towards each member. Having secret love is not Biblical. What is there to hide? If you have something to bring before the church and the fellowship, the Nazarene Faith was such (having servants in the church not lords) where every member was free to bring it up. Now, you have to go via the minister/elder for approval, and if they find it fit, they will bring it up; you don’t have the right to stand up and bring something what you’re Faith and what the Holy Spirit is guiding or teaching you. This is a wrong change in the Nazarene Faith. If there was a need for another ministering brother, the church would discuss about it, would pray about it and members were open to propose who they believed was fit for that role. AND, they had to prove BIBLICALLY why. Or, if he was not fit, again, members were open to prove again, BIBLICALLY why not!
It was never practised through secret ballot. This is something new. Because for many years some churches have practised it this way, it seems as if it’s somewhat now normal. This is a political way to practise not a Christian way or a Biblical way. We will be quick to state The Acts 1:26 (they cast lots). It could have been a Jewish custom then, but it doesn’t give us a teaching to practise it this way. Plus casting lots has nothing to do with ballots anyway.
Stating your guidance of the Holy Spirit should not be secretive. Stating your belief in word or by deed (maybe one way is by standing up), openly, is what we need to do. Open rebuke is better than secret love. Proverbs 27:5. Open rebuke is not being secretive.
People seem upset with Elder Dave because he is working with the church at Columbia Station, and not acting as a lord over that church. Why did the people leave? Why did they all leave when they heard the elders were coming to Columbia Station?
COMMENT 5:
Hey dude, if secretive ways are wrong, then how come you didn't write your name with your comment?
Columbia Station is a mess. And right now someone from there is saying... "this is the best Nazarene church in the world." Who caused the mess? Dave. That whole church should have been put under discipline until peace was made. But rather Dave took sides and tore the church to pieces.
COMMENT 6:
You people are a disgrace to the Body of Christ. Why don't you simply leave the cult of the "nazarene" church. Oh that's right, you can't because it's the only true church on earth right and everyone else is going to hell. Grow up and get out.
COMMENT 7:
To the comment that said it's not fair that they're not putting everything: I agree. Even if we don't agree with them, everyone should be given an equal chance to jump on each other's throats.
OUR COMMENT:
Please be merciful. This website does not have full-time, 24/7
staff with paid superannuation. Have a look, all your remaining
comments have been
posted where appropriate. No reason for grumpiness.
COMMENT
8: To the comment that said leave the cult of the Nazarene church... why? Why are you being so ruthless to our beloved church? We all love our church dearly or we wouldn't be in it. Just because there are bad apples doesn't mean the whole church is rotten. I truly believe that the truth is PREACHED in our church. Does everyone live it? ABSOLUTELY NOT. Do MOST live it? Even that is a "probably not." But we strive. I believe every single one of us wants ourselves AND our church to be better. What do you mean "all others are going to hell?" Nobody on here EVER said that (to my knowledge). We don't wish to be deceived. There are churches out there that preach all kinds of false doctrines. Nothing false is preached from ours. Do we live it?? Well with God's help we strive, but no, we are actually far from living it. But at least we are exposed to the full undiluted Gospel of Jesus Christ. Sorry, but I was kind of hurt by your comment of putting the Nazarene church down so bad. Sounds to me like you rebelled and the church didn't like it so now we're a "cult"... maybe you should grow up and come back instead of telling us to grow up and leave. We have no reason to leave. This is all we know and we know the truth is preached here.
COMMENT 9:
To comment 5 writer: We were talking about the voting/ballot/political ways that ‘men that have crept in’ have changed the Nazarene Faith to the way it was practised.
We can discuss the issue on why people don’t put their names down with their comments, but we were not discussing this. We were commenting on the secretive work of the church with its members as practised in some churches.
Can you please prove how ‘Elder Dave took sides and tore the church in pieces’ please?
COMMENT 10:
I understand the court case for the Sydney church is tomorrow, Aug. 26th. Please keep us updated if you can.
COMMENT 11:
Columbia station is a better place now, thanks for your concerns. The problems have all left.
COMMENT 12:
Comment 8: regarding your comment to #6 as to leaving the church. Whoever wrote that comment has the right to feel that way. Perhaps in knowing that the truth shall set them free they are aware that the gospel being preached in the church is that of the law and it sets aside the gospel of grace. That is not the gospel. Comment 6 is how so many feel the church behaves. As for trying to make out they were rebellious, they are the lucky one as the shackles that come with the false gospel need to be broken. The law was your school master until you came to grace. Even if you feel the truth is being taught, it is of no value to you if you are not enlightened to Jesus and his work on the cross. It's obvious from your comment that you are inclined toward works and this is unbiblical as it denounces Christ as being enough for salvation. It's OK if your hurt in the process of the truth being revealed. The church hurts so many and its so great to see it being shown for the sect/cult/religion that it is. It was given that label in Yugo by the media and stated that it was very dangerous to young people. As The Lord has not yet opened your eyes you do not see it. Rejoice all you who feel this way because it is true that the church is not spiritually healthy and does not seek Jesus rather their own works based salvation. You will know the truth and the truth shall set you free, and you will be free indeed. Do not assume that comment 6 is blinded, many many of us feel exactly the same and praise the good Lord for the unveiling of this truth. Amen!
COMMENT 13:
Comment 5 wrote Columbia station is a mess and comment 11 says it's a great place, seems to me the mess has been cleaned out.
COMMENT 14:
Comment 12, I would like to know WHAT we teach that is "works-based" and what we teach that is not in the Bible? It's not all about "grace." YES absolutely we are saved by grace, but taking advantage of grace as an excuse that we can do whatever and it doesn't matter what is taught from the pulpit is a GRIEVOUS sin. And I don't think even one Nazarene feels that it is by our own works that we are saved. "If you love me, you will keep my commandments." That's what Jesus says. I honestly do not believe that anything we teach in Nazarene church is not either directly from the Gospels or what the apostles wrote. And yes, of course the media in Yugo said that. That means it's right?? We judge our faith but what the world says of us?? Because we are different and don't follow what the crkva says? If that's what we judge our faith by, and try to make it to the world's liking... "tesko nama svima."
COMMENT 15:
"Columbia S. is the best church in the world." We all know who said this... the same one who blasts everyone as "no good." Only the group of 15-20 left at CS are good.
22 August 2013 - "Psychology is evil", sent by a reader
Referring
to comment on 20th August and Comment 7. Psychologists are
devil
workers! I looked up the word sin in the psychology dictionary and you
know what, you WON'T find it! You see, the concept of sin is not
recognized by modern psychology. How can a psychologist even begin to
understand the human nature if the reality of sin is ignored? They
can't. The Word of God is absolutely essential to understanding the
human psyche, for no other Book on the planet addresses the issue of
man being a vile sinner. Psychology is sinful because it attempts to
heal men's souls without addressing the issues of sin, repentance, or
God. Psychology is of the Devil. The answer is not reformation,
rehabilitation, education, nor legislation; but regeneration. Ye must
be born-again (John 3:7)! Repent for the time is very near, repent,
forgive and return anything that does not belong to you.
CLICK HERE TO CONTINUE READING >>
CLICK HERE TO CONTINUE READING >>
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17 August 2013 - Life is so hard without Matea
Sydney - Matea
Lincu's estranged wife Ljubica has been released from the mental
institution where she was put against her will, and now is finally
home. Ljubica invited a group of members of the Sydney congregation to
visit her and wanted to show them that she did not lack anything.
Indeed, the pictures speak for themselves. Even after 10 years of
living separately from Matea, Ljubica is fine, and perfectly able to
look after herself and her household. So, Matea, why did you put your
wife in a mental hospital?
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Greetings.
Can we have some more information on Ljubica? Does she still attend
church every Sunday or is she too ill? If so, does she attend Katka's
church or the Sydney church? Also, I don't mean any disrespect, but do
you people in Australia not wear headcoverings? Even with church people
over I see she's bare-headed.
OUR COMMENT:
Greetings! Headcovering? She probably does not wear it at home. No, she
never goes to Katka's place. Those two, as you may imagine, are not the
best friends. Ljubica sometimes visits the church in Arncliffe, now
when Matea is not there. She has to catch the train to come to
church and on the way back somebody drops her home. Ljubica's two
sisters, Milica and Jelica, go to Katka and Matea, mostly to argue
there. They do not go there every Sunday but maybe every second
Sunday... they always say they won't be going anymore but then
they go again.
COMMENT 2:
I
was just looking at the pictures you put up on Ljubica. And the
memories flooded back, to the days as a young girl, I admired her for
she always looked and dressed so elegantly. And I can see that she
hasn't changed. It's so nice to see that she still looks immaculate as
ever. Obviously she is managing quite well for someone who supposedly
is in a mental state. She seems to be doing fine without Matija. I wish
her all the best and that she lives the rest of her life in peace and
happiness.
COMMENT 3:
I' m a bit confused with the question regarding head coverings. Down here in Aussie land they have females with short hair and a covering on, some with none wearing in the shops, wearing pants, short skirts, open tops, make up and this all began from Brisbane church. Then you can see people from different faiths where they dress conservative and respectful.
COMMENT 4:
To the comment regarding it all beginning from Brisbane church... while yes, it might be there too, but I believe it started in Sydney. Our faith in Australia is washing away in every way, both in love and in outward appearance. We're not really much different from the world at all.
COMMENT 5:
1 Corinth. Ch 11:
But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.
Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.
Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.
For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.
Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?
Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?
But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.
But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.
COMMENT 6:
Long hair is a covering... very interesting; and we shouldn't argue about this topic... very interesting!
COMMENT 7:
I don't know who said this all started in Brisbane about the apparel and head coverings and all. Not sure it even started in Sydney. I think it started years ago in Melbourne. I DON'T want to start a whole topic now about head covers, so please let's NOT dwell on that. I just wanted to say that to the person who put the scriptures there in Corinthians about the head cover, it does say that a woman should have her head covered when she prays or prophesies. I do agree that if you have believers in your house visiting, or you go to visit believers, you should have a head cover on, as well as in church of course. But the Bible does not say a woman should ALWAYS have her head covered. If that were the case, then why would the teaching be for when she prays or prophesies? Perhaps Ljubica was comfortable enough with these people who visited her to not wear a head cover. We should not judge her. She was in her own home. Not all Christian women wear head covers all day in their own home. If some feel to do it, that's fine, but don't condemn those that don't. If the argument is that women should always pray "without ceasing", then a man should NEVER have his head covered, as he too, should pray "without ceasing". I see many Christian men wear hats or baseball caps, so maybe they shouldn't wear them. Like I said, I do NOT want to open another can of worms on the head cover issue, PLEASE LET'S NOT, as that is ENDLESS and we will have 100 different opinions on here. I just wanted to say that we shouldn't judge Ljubica for not having a head cover on. As for the apparel, like women wearing pants, shorts, low cut tops, etc... it did NOT start in Brisbane. That was many years ago already in Melbourne.
COMMENT 8:
The verses quoted in Corinthians says a woman should have her head covered when she prays or prophesieth. The third paragraph says a man indeed ought NOT to cover his head. So obviously we are talking here about when a woman or man is "praying or prophesying". The contents of this verse is talking about prayer & prophecy. Let's not add to the word of God. If a woman should always have her head covered, even if she is not praying or prophesying, then a man should never have his head covered, even if he is not praying or prophysying. Is that right? But ohhhh... another discussion on this? NO, let's leave it. Each to their own faith... Jesus said according to your faith.
COMMENT 9:
Church should not allow female rebellion. Women should maintain their distinctively feminine hair, and when custom dictated, they must wear a covering... not a 2 by 4 or a lace, but a proper covering.
COMMENT 10:
Romans Ch.14 says clearly how Christians should practice their faith. Vrs.4: Who are you to judge another's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand. Vrs.19; Therefore let us pursue the things which make for peace and the things by which one may edify another. Vrs.20; All things indeed are pure, but it is evil for the man who eats with offence. Dear readers get the BIBLE and read from Vrs.21 to the end. So if your brother or sister is offended if you do not wear head coverings, then wear it; but if they don't have problems with it, you do not need to wear it. I would say, friends that came to visit Ljubica, did not wear head coverings either. And no! It didn't start in Brisbane, Sydney or Melbourne, but about 50 years ago in European's churches. Germany, Austria and some city churches in Serbia like Beograd, Zemun and Novi Sad. People from cities were always a little bit different from the village ones. There are greater problems than head covering.
COMMENT 11:
COMMENT 9, when you said proper covering did you mean how Muslim women cover thier heads? That would be the only proper way. Everything is just a symbol.
COMMENT 12:
Actually, let's say it began in America/Canada since they are very liberal and isn't Paul Pentsa from there?? Let's get back to the covetous where people take churches and homes, isn't this what the site all began with... it's more important then headcoverings since it states in the 10 commandments.
COMMENT 13:
1 Corinthians 11:15 - "But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering." The hair is the part on the head that NEEDS to be covered. The "hair" is the part given to the women to cover.
COMMENT 14:
To the comment who said naked dressing started in Yugoslavia... no it did not. It started in Switzerland and got worse and worse until the whole country was excommunicated from the Nazarene faith in or 1983. Members have old letters that the Yugoslav elders wrote to them condemning their belief of not wearing head covers even in church. Well from there it probably spread to Germany as well and Austria (or maybe they had their own seeds sprouting there). But a lot of Austrian churches were excommunicated in the 80s too. Neither those churches nor any Switzerland churches are considered Nazarenes today. They have a different name.
COMMENT 15:
My wife told me that she would feel very embarrassed should she be seen without a head covering, (meaning a covering that's not just a 2x4). I'm glad and blest and honoured as her husband that she does dress/behave that way.
COMMENT 16:
Comments 11 and 12: I agree with you both. First of all how do we know that Ljubica doesn't have a head covering on, just because it doesn't cover her chin and her cheeks doesn't mean she is not wearing some sort of lace on the top. And since when is this discussion more important than some of the others that people refuse to address or comment on. Such as the problems in Mexico where one large family refuses to attend because of the elders? Mr. Doug Savin in Africa helping the poor but refuses to help his own? The corruption of Jim Igic and how he scolded a poor brother that quit church because of him. Let's get back to the REAL ISSUES of the Nazarene faith. The corruption in Australia and abroad by the so called Elders. Leave Ljubica in peace. Her place looks so awesome, no way a mental person could keep herself and her place looking so great.
COMMENT 3:
I' m a bit confused with the question regarding head coverings. Down here in Aussie land they have females with short hair and a covering on, some with none wearing in the shops, wearing pants, short skirts, open tops, make up and this all began from Brisbane church. Then you can see people from different faiths where they dress conservative and respectful.
COMMENT 4:
To the comment regarding it all beginning from Brisbane church... while yes, it might be there too, but I believe it started in Sydney. Our faith in Australia is washing away in every way, both in love and in outward appearance. We're not really much different from the world at all.
COMMENT 5:
1 Corinth. Ch 11:
But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.
Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.
Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.
For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.
Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?
Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?
But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.
But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.
COMMENT 6:
Long hair is a covering... very interesting; and we shouldn't argue about this topic... very interesting!
COMMENT 7:
I don't know who said this all started in Brisbane about the apparel and head coverings and all. Not sure it even started in Sydney. I think it started years ago in Melbourne. I DON'T want to start a whole topic now about head covers, so please let's NOT dwell on that. I just wanted to say that to the person who put the scriptures there in Corinthians about the head cover, it does say that a woman should have her head covered when she prays or prophesies. I do agree that if you have believers in your house visiting, or you go to visit believers, you should have a head cover on, as well as in church of course. But the Bible does not say a woman should ALWAYS have her head covered. If that were the case, then why would the teaching be for when she prays or prophesies? Perhaps Ljubica was comfortable enough with these people who visited her to not wear a head cover. We should not judge her. She was in her own home. Not all Christian women wear head covers all day in their own home. If some feel to do it, that's fine, but don't condemn those that don't. If the argument is that women should always pray "without ceasing", then a man should NEVER have his head covered, as he too, should pray "without ceasing". I see many Christian men wear hats or baseball caps, so maybe they shouldn't wear them. Like I said, I do NOT want to open another can of worms on the head cover issue, PLEASE LET'S NOT, as that is ENDLESS and we will have 100 different opinions on here. I just wanted to say that we shouldn't judge Ljubica for not having a head cover on. As for the apparel, like women wearing pants, shorts, low cut tops, etc... it did NOT start in Brisbane. That was many years ago already in Melbourne.
COMMENT 8:
The verses quoted in Corinthians says a woman should have her head covered when she prays or prophesieth. The third paragraph says a man indeed ought NOT to cover his head. So obviously we are talking here about when a woman or man is "praying or prophesying". The contents of this verse is talking about prayer & prophecy. Let's not add to the word of God. If a woman should always have her head covered, even if she is not praying or prophesying, then a man should never have his head covered, even if he is not praying or prophysying. Is that right? But ohhhh... another discussion on this? NO, let's leave it. Each to their own faith... Jesus said according to your faith.
COMMENT 9:
Church should not allow female rebellion. Women should maintain their distinctively feminine hair, and when custom dictated, they must wear a covering... not a 2 by 4 or a lace, but a proper covering.
COMMENT 10:
Romans Ch.14 says clearly how Christians should practice their faith. Vrs.4: Who are you to judge another's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand. Vrs.19; Therefore let us pursue the things which make for peace and the things by which one may edify another. Vrs.20; All things indeed are pure, but it is evil for the man who eats with offence. Dear readers get the BIBLE and read from Vrs.21 to the end. So if your brother or sister is offended if you do not wear head coverings, then wear it; but if they don't have problems with it, you do not need to wear it. I would say, friends that came to visit Ljubica, did not wear head coverings either. And no! It didn't start in Brisbane, Sydney or Melbourne, but about 50 years ago in European's churches. Germany, Austria and some city churches in Serbia like Beograd, Zemun and Novi Sad. People from cities were always a little bit different from the village ones. There are greater problems than head covering.
COMMENT 11:
COMMENT 9, when you said proper covering did you mean how Muslim women cover thier heads? That would be the only proper way. Everything is just a symbol.
COMMENT 12:
Actually, let's say it began in America/Canada since they are very liberal and isn't Paul Pentsa from there?? Let's get back to the covetous where people take churches and homes, isn't this what the site all began with... it's more important then headcoverings since it states in the 10 commandments.
COMMENT 13:
1 Corinthians 11:15 - "But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering." The hair is the part on the head that NEEDS to be covered. The "hair" is the part given to the women to cover.
COMMENT 14:
To the comment who said naked dressing started in Yugoslavia... no it did not. It started in Switzerland and got worse and worse until the whole country was excommunicated from the Nazarene faith in or 1983. Members have old letters that the Yugoslav elders wrote to them condemning their belief of not wearing head covers even in church. Well from there it probably spread to Germany as well and Austria (or maybe they had their own seeds sprouting there). But a lot of Austrian churches were excommunicated in the 80s too. Neither those churches nor any Switzerland churches are considered Nazarenes today. They have a different name.
COMMENT 15:
My wife told me that she would feel very embarrassed should she be seen without a head covering, (meaning a covering that's not just a 2x4). I'm glad and blest and honoured as her husband that she does dress/behave that way.
COMMENT 16:
Comments 11 and 12: I agree with you both. First of all how do we know that Ljubica doesn't have a head covering on, just because it doesn't cover her chin and her cheeks doesn't mean she is not wearing some sort of lace on the top. And since when is this discussion more important than some of the others that people refuse to address or comment on. Such as the problems in Mexico where one large family refuses to attend because of the elders? Mr. Doug Savin in Africa helping the poor but refuses to help his own? The corruption of Jim Igic and how he scolded a poor brother that quit church because of him. Let's get back to the REAL ISSUES of the Nazarene faith. The corruption in Australia and abroad by the so called Elders. Leave Ljubica in peace. Her place looks so awesome, no way a mental person could keep herself and her place looking so great.
OUR COMMENT: Amen!
Please do not send any new comments regarding Ljubica Lincu &
the
head covering customs. It is time to move on. Thank you.
14 August 2013 - "There is no perfect church", sent by a reader
Ahhhh,
nothing like getting up in the morning to fresh Nazarene updates. It's
a good thing there's such a big time change between USA and Australia,
you update while we sleep. Then there's always something new and
exciting to look forward to in the mornings.
Anyway, I'm surprised to hear there are problems in Mexico Nazarene church too. The way the elders praise your guys' faith and love over there makes it sound like it's the perfect church. They love you guys way more than us in USA in Canada and especially Australia. Or at least they pretend too. But from this comment now I'm questioning that as well. But, someone closer to that side of the world: Isn't there a lot of San Diegoans that attend Tecate church?
COMMENT 1:
To the write from Tecate Mexico. Are you able to elaborate on your comment? Perhaps what exactly are some of the issues you and the church are dealing with that you can no longer attend there? Thanks.
COMMENT 2:
We heard George Bodjanac was in Africa too. Anyone else know who else went?
By the way Website administrators, it is kind of confusing the way you order the site, would it be possible to put all the comments from one day placed under a new day like you used to? Because sometimes we just look at the webpage and don't scroll down when we don't see today's date; then assume there is nothing from that day. Hope that makes sense a little.
COMMENT 3:
Dear website, what is the current deal with the "church" in Perth? We are hearing here in the USA that they have church around a table? How many members are there? And who is there? Also what about Szabo? Is he really all that bad? Doesn't seem like it.
I agree with the comment that said it's getting a bit too hard now to follow this website. When you put a new comment on, we have to scroll down through everything to see if anything is new. Can't you just put all the new comments on in one day, no matter what the topic is about? That way, we don't have to scroll down to see if we are missing anything. It would be much easier to read that way, and we don't have to worry bout missing any comments that came on here. Just trying to make it easier. I mean, I think we are all intelligent enough to figure out what topics the comments are made on. I hate having to scroll down all the time. Thanks.
Anyway, I'm surprised to hear there are problems in Mexico Nazarene church too. The way the elders praise your guys' faith and love over there makes it sound like it's the perfect church. They love you guys way more than us in USA in Canada and especially Australia. Or at least they pretend too. But from this comment now I'm questioning that as well. But, someone closer to that side of the world: Isn't there a lot of San Diegoans that attend Tecate church?
COMMENT 1:
To the write from Tecate Mexico. Are you able to elaborate on your comment? Perhaps what exactly are some of the issues you and the church are dealing with that you can no longer attend there? Thanks.
COMMENT 2:
We heard George Bodjanac was in Africa too. Anyone else know who else went?
By the way Website administrators, it is kind of confusing the way you order the site, would it be possible to put all the comments from one day placed under a new day like you used to? Because sometimes we just look at the webpage and don't scroll down when we don't see today's date; then assume there is nothing from that day. Hope that makes sense a little.
COMMENT 3:
Dear website, what is the current deal with the "church" in Perth? We are hearing here in the USA that they have church around a table? How many members are there? And who is there? Also what about Szabo? Is he really all that bad? Doesn't seem like it.
OUR COMMENT: The
church in Perth is currently going through a "revival", now they have 7
members plus some children. They gather in Andrew Szabo's house. As for
Andrew himself, we have said enough, let's wait and see if someone else
is willing to send their opinion.
COMMENT
4: I agree with the comment that said it's getting a bit too hard now to follow this website. When you put a new comment on, we have to scroll down through everything to see if anything is new. Can't you just put all the new comments on in one day, no matter what the topic is about? That way, we don't have to scroll down to see if we are missing anything. It would be much easier to read that way, and we don't have to worry bout missing any comments that came on here. Just trying to make it easier. I mean, I think we are all intelligent enough to figure out what topics the comments are made on. I hate having to scroll down all the time. Thanks.
OUR COMMENT: Thank
you for your suggestions. We always listen to "vox populi". There will
be more design changes in the future, just to make the stuff here more
enjoyable to read (well, for the majority of our visitors.)
13 August 2013 - "Doug Savin went on safari", sent by a reader
Did
you guys hear the news? Doug Savin is currently in Africa so he can
"help" them and bring souls to Christ. Yet he refuses to help his OWN
brothers and sisters in Australia who are begging and pleading for
help. It is pretty obvious that he thinks as lowly of you guys as
trash. If not lower.
COMMENT 1:
Mr. Savin thinks going to help convert the Africans will justify the wrong he is doing in Australia. Don't get me wrong, it's fine he's going to Africa but the Bible says... Galatians 6:10 "As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith." So he turns his ear to his own brothers and sisters in faith and those crying for help while trying to convert others. Mr. Savin is full of hot air, just as most of the elders are. They want the position in name only. And in regards to that picture of the baptism you posted of the new converts in Pentsa's church, why does everyone look so gloomy? Hard to tell, but it looks as if they are at a funeral waiting for the casket to be brought out.
COMMENT 2:
Just to comment to the correspondence of the 13th of August, a church is not a party or nightclub so the environment in a church should appear more serious and a time to learn and read about the word of God!!!! May God bless you all and touch your hearts that the only true way to eternal life is through God the son and the Holy Spirit... Amen.
OUR COMMENT:
Bite your tongue! Mr. Savin's right is to travel wherever-whenever he
likes. Sooner or later he will find his way to Australia. We are just
afraid he won't find many people here to talk to. Anyway, don't
think Mr. Savin is completely disinterested in our Australian
affairs -
we've had a few visits from Botswana and Côte d’Ivoire in the past,
which probably means that Mr Savin is keeping an eye on our website.
COMMENT 1:
Mr. Savin thinks going to help convert the Africans will justify the wrong he is doing in Australia. Don't get me wrong, it's fine he's going to Africa but the Bible says... Galatians 6:10 "As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith." So he turns his ear to his own brothers and sisters in faith and those crying for help while trying to convert others. Mr. Savin is full of hot air, just as most of the elders are. They want the position in name only. And in regards to that picture of the baptism you posted of the new converts in Pentsa's church, why does everyone look so gloomy? Hard to tell, but it looks as if they are at a funeral waiting for the casket to be brought out.
COMMENT 2:
Just to comment to the correspondence of the 13th of August, a church is not a party or nightclub so the environment in a church should appear more serious and a time to learn and read about the word of God!!!! May God bless you all and touch your hearts that the only true way to eternal life is through God the son and the Holy Spirit... Amen.
| Greetings from Mexico! Greetings in the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. I just want to quickly write because I was surprised to see your website, with all the problems going on there, apparently for years now. Well, so much of this going on I tell you, because our family has suffered much on this side of the hemisphere due to the lack of a real Godly and spiritual fellowship, greatly due to the leadership here also. We are a family of eleven and my husband and I are members in the Tecate, Mexico church since Feb. 27, 1990, but can't even fellowship there anymore. The lack of concern from the San Diego church does not surprise me, and even other "spiritual brothers". God bless you as you endeavour in doing our Lord's will. In Christ, __________________ (I do wish to remain anonymous for now) |
COMMENT 3:
So
nice to hear from those people in Mexico. IMHO it just goes to show God
has his followers all over the globe despite what the accn/nazareene
etc. leadership would have us believe, but of course this is to
establish their own kingdom/church, and so they can rule by fear and
not lose those converts who just might prefer to believe the word of
God over "the commandments of men", church dogma, etc. They
won't
admit it openly but their attitudes and teachings show what they
believe and truth is sacrificed in the name of expedience in order to
establish their positions. The accn in Oz is a basket case and has been
for years, blame the Romanians, or part thereof.
COMMENT 4:
Dear Website Administrator,
I submitted a response to Comment 5 on August 8, which asked a direct question to me. Why won't you post my reply?
Comment 2, please... Of course a church is not a party; but have you heard of the term "rejoicing in the Lord"?? Especially on the day of baptism, the happiest day of your life. Perhaps not if you are from Australia, and tell Janko Tomek that church is not a night club... ummm I mean strip club.
COMMENT 4:
Dear Website Administrator,
I submitted a response to Comment 5 on August 8, which asked a direct question to me. Why won't you post my reply?
OUR COMMENT:
Sorry, can't find your message. Please send it again. But generally
speaking - we do not post every single message we receive. If you are
able to see some of them you would have no problem to understand why is
that.
COMMENT
5: Comment 2, please... Of course a church is not a party; but have you heard of the term "rejoicing in the Lord"?? Especially on the day of baptism, the happiest day of your life. Perhaps not if you are from Australia, and tell Janko Tomek that church is not a night club... ummm I mean strip club.
 FROM A READER: Hi, I liked your comment a while ago about the 2 dons... who were they... oh yes, Paolo Pentsolini and Gianco Tomassini, but I wanted to distinguish between those 2 and another don. Don Smallgoods is a good don (Is Don. Is Good) by comparison... like chalk and cheese really. |
| Spiritual and Mental Abuse in ACCN in Australia - Page 13 |